Helene Nørlem, Co-founder - tiimo

Some of you may know that 3% of children in Denmark are affected with the ADHD disorder. That's actually one child in every school class that are struggling to concentrate with interactions and some even have social anxiety. Also, children with ADHD actually have 50 times less chance of establishing long-lasting friendships. So, we are talking about a disability that has a severely detrimental impact on the child's quality of life. We have designed Timo with the aim of helping these children. Our research showed that to help these children, we needed to provide them with three things. Structure, we need to present an overview, and we need to emphasize their successes, the success stories of the child during their days. And these three things are what Timo is designed around. Timo works as a little helper that guides and supports the child during the day. As an interactive little friend, it gives ongoing advice and helps the child by providing an overview of what he or she has to do. It could be go to school, to play soccer, or maybe to do homework. This ongoing interaction enables the child to be one step ahead of what he or she has to do. And by providing them with this overview, they naturally get more energy to focus on being in social interactions. So, integrated into this supportive design is also a reward system. You can see it maybe over here. But, where the parents can reward the child through motivational points. So, not only does this give the child a very accessible overview of their successes, but these points also works as a kind of currency that the child can use to exchange these well-earned points, to maybe not do the dishes for a week. So, this is actually a picture of how we prototype this feature in the app. So, you can also see we are still in very early stage start-up, since we are still prototyping some analog, in a very analog way. That being said, now we have Timo. Timo has been in the hands of teachers and parents and institutions for a couple of months. And the feedback has been overwhelming. The feedback has been overwhelmingly positive. Parents are buzzing about Timo on their social support networks. Teachers are recommending Timo to their colleagues. And most importantly, the children are asking about using Timo. So, I think that, I think we are onto something truly useful here. As I mentioned, Timo is still in very early age start-up. So, I don't want to talk that much about the specific, the physical design and feel of the product. Instead, I want to tell you something about, share with you the journey we had behind the product. And more specifically, how we designed some of our initial research to get some valuable insights that helped create Timo. So, when we started out this project, we had no idea what the outcome would be. trying to sort out our master thesis. And sitting at the university, we realized that the only thing we actually knew was, the only thing we had was an intention to help these children. So, where do you go from there? All good designers know that if you want to design, the key to designing a good product is knowing the user's needs. The problem with this is, of course, that rarely do you meet a person who actually understands what they need, let alone has the ability to tell you, to articulate these needs. And this is even more true when you're talking about children. So, in our case, we needed to understand the inherited needs in the lives of children with ADHD. But then imagine going up to a child and asking, so, what do you need in your life to make it better? That doesn't really work. They can't reflect in that way. So, of course, we did a lot of reading and we talked to a lot of professionals within the field who all told us that children need additional mental resources. But this brought us nowhere to actually grasping the real issues of the lives with the children living with ADHD. Rudimentary anthropology suggests that you should be a fly on the wall to be able to observe the interactions that the children have with other people. But then again, imagine just starting to stalk a kid around for a couple of weeks. You can't really do that. So, how do you get an understanding of a child with ADHD when you can't ask them? And you certainly can't stop them. So, we decided to gather insights about people's lives and thoughts in another, maybe more alternative way. We used a technique that makes use of the so-called cultural probes. Maybe some of you know it. It's a method that involves making small packages with artifacts combined with small tasks that you're giving to the participants. Hmm. They are handed out to the participants with the hope of them themselves recording their interactions and their feelings and their specific events during the days. So, we found five families that were interested in participating in this. All with a child with the ADHD diagnosis. And this is actually a picture of what we put in the packages that we gave them. However, in order for the cultural probes to yield any meaningful results, you have to give them a lot of consideration when designing them. But when you do, I really think this method is both efficient and really rewarding. So, what I'm going to share with you is how we designed our probes and some of the thoughts we put into to make this work. So, as you can see, as I told you, this was what was in our approach for the families. And they had several artifacts. They had something we called emotional user journeys. They had a box that we called the Genie Box. Some smiley stickers, an iPhone or iPad for the children. And some small cards with the tasks. And more specifically, one of the things we designed was this daily emotional journey. For the parents to fill out. The aim with this was to get an understanding of the emotion that you experience as a parent to a child with ADHD. And just more importantly, what triggers these emotions. So, in the bottom of the paper, we designed activities during the day. Some touch point activities. And we also made room for the parents to fill in extra notes. To fill in extra activities if they needed that. Then we gave them these different stickers. Representing their emotional state. As you can see, there are different kinds of emotional states. And they were to place them alongside the daily touch points. To try to describe what kind of emotional state they were at. And then we also made these areas to describe why they had chosen this specific activity. And to put on some reflections for later. Maybe that why did this happen and why did I went to that emotion. So, the parents used these smileys to monitor their emotions during the day. And this is an example of a completed emotional daily user journey. And as you can see, it's kind of easy to get an overview of what kind of emotions they had. And then you can dig into why they had the feeling that they had. So, after a couple of weeks, we had a vast amount of data. Of the parents and of their perceptions of their own feelings during the day. This way, we gained insight not normally obtained through interviews. How often do you actually remember how you felt two weeks ago on a specific day? This way, we could actually go when we did follow-up interviews. And ask specifically into these episodes and why they were feeling what they did. So, it's not enough to just know what the parents are feeling. We also needed to know what the children are thinking and feeling. And we didn't want the children to fill out the same journey as the parents. We wanted to make it more fun for them to participate. And we certainly didn't want to give them extra homework. Since we knew that would probably be a pain for them to do their daily task. So, we got the idea of putting in an iPad for the child. And we created a personal Tumblr blog for all of the children. So they could blog for us. We gave them these small task cards. And every day we asked them to make a video diary. And tell us about the worst experience of the day and the best experience of the day. And then we also frequently gave them small new tasks. Like take a selfie with your best friend. So, these blog posts gave us a lot. They didn't give us the same structured data as the parents' journeys gave us. But they gave us a very good way to actually do the follow-up interviews with the children. Because we had some kind of relation now. And we could talk about these episodes. And ask into what is a good friend for you. And how do you describe being a friend and stuff like that. And the children were more likely to open up to us. Because they kind of knew us in a different way. So, another thing we did was designing this genie box. Which is a box for wishes. And we gave one for both the children and the parents. And every day we asked them to describe their biggest wish. And we did that. This box can maybe seem a bit simple. But I actually thought that it was... We got something quite unique out of this. It meant that we were no longer simply designing for the problems. But now we were also trying to design for the wishes and the aspirations of these children. And this was just seeing the children in a completely different light. Was my experience at least. So... Yeah, last thing. We also put in a diary for the parents. To describe their best experience and their worst experience. Also to see if there was any resemblance between what the parents really remembered from a day. And what the child remembered. Or if it was a completely different way of experiencing the same day. So, and as you can see, all of these insights we got from the cultural probes and the follow-up interviews was what actually guided our design process. And now is developed into TIMO, the assistive technology for a smartwatch. So this is just one experience of doing research design for TIMO. And I would say that by using cultural probes, we were given a possibility to get a different kind of insight. Than if we had sat down and made interviews. In our case, it really helped seeing the children's lives from a different angle. In a different light. And... Yeah. I think that's one of the main reasons that we actually get that much positive feedback from TIMO. From the children. And that's just what I wanted to share with you today. And I hope that you can maybe be inspired to use some of it. And thank you for listening. Thank you. Thank you. Mike Levine, please go ahead. I feel like I have a lot to live up to after that introduction. So I'll do my best. So, I got it. Is that me that's rattling? No. Okay. So, thank you for the invitation to come and speak today. I was very excited to come. I'm told that I cover a lot of information in a very short period of time. I'm not going into a lot of depth on some topics. But I do bring you inside of some of the thinking that we have as we've developed CLU. I wanted to give a shout out to my team who is definitely watching. This is the team. So, I would like to say it's not just me that's delivering this. It's a whole team of people. I would also like to emphasize that the design is only as good as the engineering. Because without great engineers, they can't do anything really innovative with the design. And we have done some, I think, pretty innovative things with the design. So, one of our, the founder, the original founder of CLU is Edith Tin. And she's sitting here in the middle of the couch. So, that's her. So, I'm going to jump right into it. This is CLU. You might not know of CLU. It's a... I've had this problem before. I know how to fix it though. I got it. It's my earring. That happened before. So, this is CLU. It's an app for tracking health. Usually gets described as a period tracking app. I prefer to describe it as a health tracking app. So, what's happening here on the end, usually this is seen as just an app for women. I'll tell men why maybe you should be paying more attention. So, here what we're seeing in this visualization, and you'll see this now a couple of times through the presentation, this is a representation of somebody's cycle, the menstrual cycle. So, here you see the period, the fertile window, which is when conception or pregnancy can occur, and then PMS. Usually when somebody sees this for the first time, the thing that they're surprised by is how few days actually it's possible to get pregnant during the cycle. So, there are a lot of other insights that people can get when they see this visualization, when changes happen in sleep patterns, when maybe hunger changes, changes in sex drive, also mood changes. So, now maybe the guys in the audience are starting to think of like why this is maybe more relevant to them as well. So, we aim to be the number one health tracker globally, and we're on our way. Right now we have about 2 million active users. Those are active users, not downloads. Our downloading numbers are quite a bit higher than that, of course. We believe that technology will have a profound impact on family planning globally. So, when we think about the population explosion that we have on the planet right now, we think that we can actually play a role in affecting that. Coming back to a conversation about the team and what I'd like to – this will be a continuing thread through the presentation – is that we have a lot of big brains on our team, very deep thinkers. It's easily one of the most talented teams I've worked with. I'm very happy to be with this. I'm very happy to be with this very creative pile of people. What I would like to say is that along with the intellect comes a lot of compassion and a lot of insight. So, the theme that's going to be coming through this is empathy, a lot of empathy that we have with our users and what I call affectionate design. What's on our minds a lot is this. So, this is the pattern of hormones that changes throughout the fertility – throughout the menstrual cycle. So, there's a lot going on. And that's why that there's a lot – a lot that we can do in terms of insights for the people who are using Clue. The process – I'm not going to go into detail about process, but in conversations with people about how we do our work and also with our team, really our process is empathy. So, how do we get to know our users as much as possible, get deep understanding, deep compassion? There's a large variety of people that we have to get to know, and that's really the process. This is one topic I'll go into more depth on. Another topic I'll go into more depth on is science and design and the combination of the two and how they reinforce each other. And then the third topic is what I call affectionate design. So, we talk a lot about user-centered design, but I'm trying to cast that as more affectionate design for us. So, starting first with the process of empathy. So, first thing I would like to talk about is what it's like to design for women. The first question that I asked – I was asked the first time I presented about Clue was, what do women want? I was a little bit confused because I was like, well, my first response was I can't answer for all of women, and there is no singular thing. What that did, though, is it sparked a little bit of investigation for me as trying to answer what is woman? What do we mean when we say that? Is my hearing popped back up? No. So, it's complicated, obviously. So, if we think about designing for women and we were to say, put them on a matrix here, start building a matrix, and say this was age. And so, on the left side we have young and the right side we have old, and then say that there's a goal that they're having in their life. So, they want to get pregnant, they don't want to get pregnant, they're trying to understand their bodies, the rhythm of their cycle more. And then we say maybe there's different sexual orientations, and so then we put that into a different vector. And then pretty soon then we say, okay, now we can plot everybody on this, which of course we can't really, and you're probably starting to see the problem with this already. And then you realize that everybody's in motion, everybody's changing and evolving, and they're going through different things in their life. And really what we're trying to do is design a single app that covers all of these needs. I get a little bit more into this as well. The challenge that we have is that this category of app, the health tracking app, really hasn't, I would say, hasn't been done very well before. And we're trying to address all of these requirements, from all these different people. And so what we're trying to do is really design with affection for all of these different possibilities of what these people could be when they pick up Download Clue and they start using it. So designing for everyone is something that I think quite a bit about. It's similar to, I would say, people think about when they're designing a utility. I think about Clue as a utility. It's like email, it's like an Excel spreadsheet, but it's very focused on body awareness and learning about the body. The research approach that we take is continuous. We're always doing research. It's not in a phase. So the designers, myself, engineers, everybody is constantly doing research and those insights are always going into the product. For me personally, I've done somewhere around 500 personal interviews over the course of the past. We've been in the market for about two years, but working on the product for about three. And those conversations happen either in person or in text. Some of the things that have come out of that research, some of the bigger insights are people have been told that their whole lives, that their emotions are out of control and that they're linked to their cycle and they can't do anything about it. Not true, by the way. Scientifically not true. And I'm speaking always from a point of science, which I'll get to a little bit later. People don't know actually what to expect every month, so how does their body change? That changes after they've used Clue. Typically for just a few cycles they have a much better insight. And then people saying that their culture tells them what a woman is supposed to be, but that's not what they want or how they behave. And then there's this anxiety around pregnancy, either trying to avoid getting pregnant or trying to get pregnant. So you can imagine that developing segmentation and persona is either very important or irrelevant for us, and I'm on the side of it's kind of irrelevant for us. And the thinking that I've had around that, and I definitely do, I feel that persona are not relevant for us, but when we create segments we do that to reduce complexity so that we can find patterns and then design for those patterns. What we do is we disregard segments to maintain that complexity, and we find patterns then that unify that complexity instead. And so we don't use segments, we don't create segments, and you won't find in any of our documentation we don't talk about segments internally in our teams at all. And then persona, specifically about persona, I think that they can be quite offensive because they reinforce stereotypes. So for example, you see white middle-aged man wearing a tie, executive. You see a woman in her 30s, that's the mom at home. And we just don't do that at all. We don't find them useful, and I would actually offer that maybe that's a question that in your own work you can ask is that, is this actually useful or are we reinforcing something that's negative? So the approach at a very high level, scan the spectrum, so really favoring the outliers, pulling in as much diversity as we possibly can, always holding questions open. So I never consider any of the questions that we ask to be ever closed. So we're always opening these up and maybe even to the frustration of my team. Sometimes they feel like, haven't we really answered that? Maybe not, maybe not. And then what we're really looking for are these unifying patterns. I would say that a lot of the things that we do, a lot of times this could be interpreted as that we're trying to be politically correct. That is absolutely not what we're trying to do. You should hear some of the humor we use in the office. If you think we're being politically correct, we're not. So if we're not politically correct, what we're really striving for is accuracy. We're just accurate. If we're not politically correct, we're accurate. Next topic to go into is science and design. Design principles, I think, are essential and very important to help guide the work that we do and everybody's work. But I think they're oftentimes not carefully considered. They're oftentimes very repetitive, and you can use them across almost all of your projects. It's simple, it's easy to use, it's elegant, it's all of this, right? I focused on two primary design principles for Clue, really narrowing them down, is it just had to be fast and beautiful. If what we're doing is we're creating a data capture tool because we want the user to enter data so that Clue can analyze it, so that Clue can analyze the data and then give them insights back to them about their body, the more data they enter, the better it's going to be. The faster Clue is to use, the more data there will be. The second one, beautiful, just because, well, I'll get into that a little bit later and show you what I mean by beautiful. So fast, the problem that I found with the current UI for iOS and also for Android were available on both platforms is that there is no UI common standard UI elements for rapid data entry. So we had to develop our own. I did some research to go back and say, well, what actually makes an interface fast and easy to use? And I went to cognitive theory and human computer interaction principles, which I'm not going into a lot of detail here. What I thought was that actually what was pretty important is just buttons, very big, easy to hit buttons. And I was surprised that usually when you see, you have to go looking for stuff and you have to kind of aim to hit it. And I was really focused on just covering a screen all with buttons. And it did two things. It made, of course, Clue very easy to navigate, easy to hit the buttons. But it did a second thing, was it really brought forward the design. So aesthetically, then the buttons became something that were very aesthetically pleasing, and iconography has become very important to us, both in terms of the mood that we create and also making Clue very usable. The only examples that I have from the past, from iOS, are the calculator and the telephone keypad. Those are the only two things that I found for a source of inspiration for rapid data entry. And they do work for that, and you can see it's just all buttons. A concept that I discovered along the way is subitizing. So how many things, when you're looking at an interface, when you're looking at a series of objects, the human mind is able to very quickly and easily recognize that there are four or three or two or one, without having to count. And that's subitization. Fancy word. So what that means is that if you have that many elements on the page, there isn't a whole lot of thinking that needs to happen, especially if you've already encountered that screen before. You have a pretty good idea of where things are in relationship to each other, which is why then on Clue you'll only see six or fewer items per screen always. And that actually has had a really big impact on our usability. The other thing that we've considered quite a bit, is factorial relationships. So the many to many relationships between objects and actions, and the less of those that you can have, the better. As soon as you get up to 12 factorial relationships, so this one thing can be related to 12 other things, you're in the billions already. And of course the user can't keep all of that in their mind. So they're constantly learning. They're constantly on every screen. Secondly, to go over the beautiful, design principle, these are more of the screens of Clue. So here you see the second generation of our data entry there. You see the cycle view. This is the history view. I liked one of the presentations saying that every screen should have a purpose. I agree with that. The purpose of the history view, so this is all of the different cycles, is that you can actually compare in the history the lengths of the cycles, which is by a glance. So you can see which one was shortest, which one was longest, which is one of the key points. These are the key things that people are looking for when they go back and review their cycles. And these are the reminders. The reminders are all customizable. Usually when people customize them, the text, so the text that pops up on Clue, they usually make them something humorous or something extremely discreet. So for example, your period is coming up may turn into Shark Week is approaching, something like that. And what I mean by beautiful, this is Clue. The main competitors that we have look like this. And these are the largest competitors. There are smaller players out there that also have a cleaner design, so the trend is definitely towards the cleaner design. One of the comments that we got very early into our release was this one. And if you're unfamiliar with what My Little Pony looks like, this is My Little Pony. And I would agree that the design of Clue is definitely an adult, designed for adults. It's designed, hopefully for everybody, used as a contemporary design. It's really positive, empathetic, and respectful, always. Now getting more into the science side. So people who have cycles have a lot of different questions that they're asking of themselves. Am I healthy and am I normal was the question that came up most often. And people were asking me this as I was interviewing them about their, you know, what do they need? And so what we found out is actually they need quite a bit of information. Because what we learned about the cycle happened probably when we were before, we were teenagers, before the cycle actually happened. And we didn't get any new information as we went through life. People also want to know what will happen today or what will happen on a future date. So to help with this in the newest version of Clue, which will be coming out soon, it hasn't all been integrated yet. There are about 100 pages of scientifically valid text that help inform people about all the different aspects of Clue. This is quite a bit of effort you can imagine for us to create. So when I think about design, it's not just about the aesthetic or the interaction. It's also about the service that we're providing back to our users. We also have some very exciting research collaborations which are coming up with Columbia, very wonderful academic institutions who have reached out to us because of the approach that we've taken of integrating science with good design. Because they usually have to create a design and they want to create these types of tools when they want to perform their research. And they see, ah, finally somebody's done it. They've taken a scientific approach. We can use the Clue tool for this. So Columbia, Stanford, Harvard, and Oxford. Now getting into affectionate design. Everybody at Clue and our team, just about everybody does some kind of research. Well, they all do research and we all are in contact with people. Half the world's population could be a potential user of Clue. And so we're always, doing some kind of investigation. And we really have a deep affection for our users. So every point of contact that we have with our users, we're always caring for our users in some way. And trying to understand how can we care for them better. And I would say that is definitely reflected in the design. One of the most often asked questions is about privacy. I would also put into that category discretion. So privacy of the data, security, security of the data. One key thing about Clue, which not many, if any of our competitors do, is that you can use Clue without an account. In that case, the data stays on the phone. Nobody has it except for the person. Hopefully they back it up and we provide a few options for that. And so that's the most private anybody can be. If they do create an account, the data that we store is stored anonymously. And it's stored separately from the account data. It's two different records completely. And then we also, from a discretion perspective, because you can imagine that if somebody, we all use our phones out in everyday life, and where data entry is happening is sometimes on daily commutes. So we've done everything possible to create a very discreet user experience. So when somebody launches Clue, it just looks like this happy place. And people don't actually know what data is being entered. Last topic I want to go into is customer support. So we do a lot of customer support. And thanks to the team, we did a new release recently. And we have a huge amount of support that we're working through right now. Everybody's been working pretty hard on that. We respond to everybody who writes in to us over a support mechanism, which can sometimes be kind of daunting. The reason that we do that is because it really, it creates this deep understanding with our customers. We get into long-form conversations with them. So everybody who does support is trained in research. So they answer a question, and then they follow up by asking a question. So if they've asked for a feature, they want something, we ask them, well, how would you like that to work? So we ask them very open-ended questions, and sometimes these turn into weeks-long exchanges, sometimes exchanging sketches of ideas. And so this is how we do, it's a primary mechanism of our research. We also do, we have people, come in to our offices and we do beta testing. So there are many different ways that we do research, but this is a constant thread of conversation that we have with the people who are using Clue. Most often, gratefully, we have a very gracious community of users. They always are thanking us for some aspect of Clue or for just making Clue, and then they say, hey, could you please also do this? Or they say, thank you for making Clue, or thank you for making this, and how do I do this with Clue? I wanted to also put some quotes up from our users because I feel like designers, we tend to reflect, and when we get into groups like this, we tend to reflect on the product. I always am reflecting on the user as much as possible. And they have a deep impact on us when we get, I'm just going to let you read these, I'm not going to read them for you, but when we get messages like this, they have a really deep impact on the team. We actually have a channel of content on Slack where we distribute these quotes so everybody has a chance to read them. And we get ones like these. They're extremely, extremely moving. And we get these more than once, so this is not just like a one-off. So what we realized through the work that we're doing, we're creating a very accessible tool, something that people have a very easy time using. They have a very easy time integrating it into their life. It's a happy experience. It's a joyful experience, hopefully. In the original user testing, what I was looking for was a smile. I really wasn't looking as much about from a usability perspective. I was looking to see if I could make somebody crack up. So could I make them laugh? And if you see some of the iconography, which I didn't focus on in this presentation, for example, the icon for tracking sex is a reclining man. So he's kind of like, hey, kind of looking at you. But if you have the chance to download and check it out, the iconography we spent quite a bit of time on, especially we recently expanded the tracking options, and there are now about 100, there are way over 100 icons. You can imagine that's a lot of work, iconography. If you have done icons, you know that that's a lot of work. So what this has done for us when we provide this kind of empathetic, and affectionate experience for our users, we get happy people, a lot of happy people. So literally I did some analysis and number crunching as best as I'm able to do, and I mean almost 100% people who are writing to us, who contact us, they are happy back at us. So the experience that we have of working on the team, we're actually finding that that's extending back into our users, which we did not expect. Grumpy people is a very, very small situation. Statistically not significant. We also focus on them. We probably put even more attention into them, understand why they're upset, what could we be doing better. Those turn into some of the longer conversations that we've had. But what we found ultimately is that when you give affection, you get affection back, and I think that is something that all myself have been surprised by when we were only just four people working out of a living room of the co-founders, and now that our team has expanded, that everybody is deeply affected by that type of emotional interaction that we have with our users. So that's it. And if you have a desire to contact us, you can maybe ask them if you have questions about anything that we're doing. Again, we will give you the same kind of treatment that we give to the people who are using Clue. You can tweet at us there, or me on the right-hand side there. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Let's do something different this time. Looks great. Sitting there all start-up-y and super clever. Yeah, I found that personally quite mind-breaking. Maybe one of you did something that I personally connected to a lot. So thank you. Does that leave room for any questions at all? Because we'd like to have a shared Q&A. Yes? Maybe this question could be relevant to you. Can you say who you are? I'm Nicky, and I work at Driver. And I have a question specifically for the Paws app. But if you feel like you want to answer it as well, then I guess you're free to. I'm thinking you talked a lot about information overload. And I'm wondering if you have any thoughts that you could share with us about, like, how you are going to make the app a habit, how you're going to form a habit with the user beyond delivering a good user experience. So, yeah, to put it very bluntly, how are you going to avoid actually doing exactly the opposite of what you set out to do with notifications, et cetera? Yes, thank you for your question. It's really a good one. And the fundamental difference of the Paws app, if you think about the interaction and feedback perspective in design, that all the other apps is about providing, you know, using technology and design to create content so that attracting our attention, right? But the Paws app is completely opposite. It's the person himself pay attention, can wait by this kind of slow, continuous, gentle movement, sensed by technology, and technology give feedback. So the person is in the dominant seat always. So then it's a matter of what kind of motivation you can get. You can give the person. You can give. It's really nice visual design, different kind of soundtrack, or even social. You know, there are different possibilities to extend this. Does that answer your question? Okay. Okay, more questions? Yes, over there on the left. I'll take it. Hi, thank you. Nordin from Cisco. This is Wokleyu. It's just a question of business model. Do you plan, by curiosity, the positioning of this application and to be an indicator for the medical gynecologist, for example, like to be able for the end user to give a report to the gynecologist, so not being like a personal app, but more an assistant and link app to the medical and female woman. Yeah, it's something that we've thought about. It is currently possible to print out a report. It gives basic information. It's a first MVP version of that. So that is possible that we have a long ways to go for that. So that is an avenue that we are focused on long term. I wouldn't say that we have decided yet in terms of what we would monetize. So in terms of monetization, we have a variety of different ways that we can go. Right now, we're focused on growth, growth and retention. Cool, thank you. More questions? Questions? Yeah? You're very modest. If you don't say anything, I will. So good, thank you, Joachim. So just a quick question to Mike. Is that a corporate font? I get asked about that a lot. It's really nice. No, it's called Mr. Eves from Emigre. There you go. Thank you. This is the lightweight version. It's really nice. Okay, stop geeking around with the fonts. Yeah. Yeah? So I have a question for Timo. You didn't talk much about your design because it's in the process. Could you share some of the thoughts? What is your biggest... Are you doing the design right now as we speak? We are, yeah. What is your biggest challenge for your audience and your domain in the design process? I think it's making it as user-friendly as possible because we actually need these parents and children to go in and set up these. These calendars and these schedules for the day, for the children. And we just need to do that so they won't... So they will keep coming back and actually do this. So making this as user-friendly as possible is what we're really working about right now. Yeah. I would like to offer this might be a great opportunity for men to ask another guy who's maybe a little bit more informed. A question if you have some burning question. Yes. And you have to do it in complete public in front of 100 designers. Yay! Because then we can all learn. Yeah. Okay. Okay, maybe it was too much lunch. We have a question? Also, a question to you from Clue. It was not on purpose. I rhymed. But, no, the connection to other apps like LiveSun, Indomondo, Move, and so on, were actually... How are you connected to those apps? How can I actually track my period and then connect it to how much should I run in this week? Mm-hmm. What is your plan there? Or do we already have a plan? We don't have any integrations with other apps yet. We are able to exchange data through Apple Health Kit. Okay. So, Apple Health Kit synchronizes data across different apps. There is a limited amount of the data that we track that Apple does exchange. And to get around that limitation, we do plan to do some more integrations with other apps. We do. So, for example, one of the scientific-based findings is that, yes, there is a link between... Not enough research has been done, so I'm hearing the voice of one of my PhDs on my team who's saying that it needs to be further verified. But there is some link indicated so far between energy level and exercise, peak performance at different points in the cycle, for example. So having that information and being able to send it to, for example, a running app would be really useful. And so we do know about those things, and we do plan to do more of those. Great. And actually, also, just a small question. How are you guys making money? Mm-hmm. Like, what is the business strategy behind this? What is the business case? When do they do a subscription? At what point? And how do you, yeah, make money out of great design? Are you asking all of us? Yeah, all of you. Like, each one of you. Because it's great in dimensions, but making money... Should I start? Yeah, please. Right now, we are not making any money because we haven't launched yet. So that's pretty simple. The thought is a subscription model and to give the users a possibility to try it out for maybe one or two months for free, and then a subscription-based model. So we are still testing what should the price be, but we're trying to not be too expensive. Yeah. Jing? Ping? Ping, yes. Yeah, so for the PaaS app, specifically, it will be a paid app. It's a $2 app. So because it is... It's a very effective tool you can use, and it works. So, and after that, I haven't think too much about. And, but this same approach can be integrated into so many different objects. Now we just turn a mobile phone into a calming device. So I'm also very much looking forward to, you know, talking to other companies how we can, in that way, a consultancy service or in that way also. Yeah. I can't be specific because we don't talk about our monetization strategy publicly. We have, but right now we're focused on retention and growth, and we do plan to be the number one tracker. And at that point, we plan to then monetize after that. The goal that we have is to do what we call a native monetization strategy, so it will very much reflect the brand values and the qualities, that empathy, that affection that we have. So we won't be breaking that trust and the relationship that we have with the user at that point. Very interesting. Thank you. Thank you. Do we have a last question? This, yes? Go ahead. I have to get my phone. Hi. I'm Ericsson from the Merce Group. Just wanted to, I'm quite interested with what Clue did in terms of, and also the user feedback that you created that trust with the users and how, you know, basically how moving the comments were towards the app. And I think that's quite interesting how you did that. But could you give us a feedback, a background on, you know, how you designed, like, the typeface? I'm really interested with typeface as well. Like, the choice of the typeface, the choice of the colors, you know, what made you, you know, give us a little background on that, basically. Yeah. When I started working with Edith, Edith Tin is Danish. She had a very specific goal and some requirements. And I think that was that there would be no pink, was one of them, because you saw the apps that I showed, they look like they're designed for My Little Pony, or they look like they're designed for a teenager. So we decided to use contemporary design. So artful and contemporary design, pushing it as far as we could, but still keeping it, focusing on usability, but how can we make Clue as beautiful as possible and as gender neutral as possible is how it gets interpreted quite a bit. I wasn't really considering gender a whole lot when designing. I just wanted to make something that looked good. And then that started to just drive everything. There's a lot of the research findings pointed out that there's a lot of negative associations, generally, with the menstrual cycle. So it's cramps, it's headaches, it's, you know, the things that people typically talk about. They don't talk so much about the positive things, which are, for example, higher sex drive at different points, peak exercise, moments for exercise. So what we're trying to do is not reinforce the negative. We're trying to reinforce the positive. And so as we go on in evolving the product, more of that will occur over time. But the original design was to create this just happy, joyful space where people didn't feel like they had to feel negative about what they were tracking. So that was really the driving decision and the insights around that. Thank you. Thank you.